Modular Homes Suck!

[modularhomessuck]

Beware: Do not buy a modular home until you learn of our nightmare
experience.

We bought our new modular home from New Millenium, Warner, NH. The home
was built by ProBuilt; Miffleton, PA. The dealer refuses to fix any
problems stating we needed to contact within a year of taking possesion.
The problem is some problems (ie. mold,mildew moisture) took more than a
year to develop. further, some problems (ie. siding) required that the
building systems be dismantled. The dealer states now that more than a
year has transpiredThe following are the problems we have to file a claim
with the home warranty people. The dealer must know, a reasonable person
would expect, that the home warranty, a major selling point of theirs so
they must be familar with its provisions, does not cover water, moisture,
siding etc. The problems:

1. All exterior doors out of square.
2.All exterior doors leak lke seives when it rains.
3. Moisture infiltration somewhere near my daughter's room causing a
mildew odor.
4. Baseboard trim nail shot through drain pipe rendering sink unusable.
They said they were willing to fix this one but the process the required
was too ardous. Also, they did such a shitty job taping the hole I did
not want to cut a hole in the drywall. The vanity needed to be removed to
spare my wall any more patch jobs.
5. Bubbling and sliced vinyl kitchen floor. Once again they said they
were willing to repair this but also stated the whole floor would need to
be replaced. They would not replace it in kind, instead they wanted to
substitute inferior flooring for it.
6. Improperly installed siding.
7. Incomplete attic insulation which allows condensation to form under
the attic deck. I found this today as I was hiding Christmas presents. I
noticed one board was saturated. I began pulling up the decking and the
problem was widespread. As I said, this was found today, approx. 2 yrs
and 3 months after taking possesion. I haven't decided what to do yet.
8. Peeling cabinet veneer. They did provide new veneer but left it to us
to install.
9. One driver delivering the house arrived four hours late, got stuck for
more than 30 minutes down at the corner, ran over the stop sign, went of
the road coming up our straight road, got stuck turning into our driveway,
crushed our culvert, got stuck again in the driveway. Our dealer's
comment was, "Boy, I don't know what is up with George. He's usually one
of our best drivers". Later she did concede that she heard the crew
laughing about how bad he was. She also offered to replace the culvert.
10. No consistant pattern or logic to the electrical wiring (ie.
different corresponding switches in different rooms activate different
lights)

This why I believe modular homes, New Millenium and ProBuilt Homes suck.

I elect to remain anonymous because once we can sell this place in good
conscience we are selling. This place will never be right.

Anonymous.
-------------------------------------



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[Matt Whiting]

I elect to remain anonymous because ... I'm making this up and don't want to get caught.

[PeterD]

Post by modularhomessuck
I elect to remain anonymous because once we can sell this place in good
conscience we are selling. This place will never be right.

Good conscience? bwa-ha-ha-ha!

What did the home warranty people say, when you asked them? You forgot
to add that to your rant.

As to your problems, if you really feel you were treated unfairly,
then hire an lawyer and file for relief. There is a method to resolve
these types of problems, and you are not following the methods to
speak of.

You need someone who is independant of you and the builder to evaluate
the situation, do that first.

[Lou]

How hard could this be.
Set it on fire, go to dinner.

[marson]

On a number of occasions, I've had modular homes salesmen give me this
BS that their product costs less than site built because they are
built in a factory under controlled conditions. Fact is, they often
cost less because they are slapped together garbage--if a decent
contractor was asked to produce a home of the same design and quality
as many of the modular homes we see, his price would be competitive.
In construction, time is money. The only way to put out a quality
product is by spending more time on the details, and that is going to
cost more. That's the way it is.

[Matt W. Barrow]

Post by marson
On a number of occasions, I've had modular homes salesmen give me this
BS that their product costs less than site built because they are
built in a factory under controlled conditions.
Fact is, they often
cost less because they are slapped together garbage--

And I've seen a lot of pretty shabby stick-built construction done that way
and worse.

Post by marson
if a decent
contractor was asked to produce a home of the same design and quality
as many of the modular homes we see, his price would be competitive.
In construction, time is money. The only way to put out a quality
product is by spending more time on the details, and that is going to
cost more. That's the way it is.

So what's your point? That some people use shitty materials? Or poor QC?

Well DUH!

[Dennis]

In a small town south of here, an entire subdivision was built so shabbily
the over 50% go up and walked away. (Not related to interest rates). The
truth is, there are some poor modular manufacturers and some poor general
contractors. And conversely, there are some excellent ones as well.

My former secretary and her husband put a mod on their lake property and
it's a beautiful home; better than the neighbors which was site built. Yes
they did have a few problems as I recall, but the manufacturer replaced four
rooms of carpeting an some other stuff. (Carpet didn't match as I recall).

Anyways they came away with a nice raised ranch with walk-out basement in a
channel lot and they figured they saved over $40k vs. what the site built
contractors had quoted. (Their figures, not mine).

Sorry you are having so many problems with your new home (new homes always
have problems if you didn't know.) When I built my current home, the
contractor put the concrete patio in the wrong location! I made him repour
it and part of it is now 8" deep. (Actually there was a whole list, some
they fixed, some they wimped out of fixing, such is the reality of
construction.)

As your door leak it sounds to me as if the foundation isn't level (major
reason for windows no working). Doors are prehung and built square by the
door manufacture. A home not setting level with spring the doors (and
possibly windows) very quickly. (Drywall cracks as well).

In any case I wouldn't sit around whining about the problem, I would get a
tube of exterior silicone caulk and seal up around the doors to prevent the
leaks. (I would also check the windows as well). You are not just a consumer
but also a homeowner; and you must take responsibility to make repairs to
the more serious problems, no matter who's at fault.

The condensation in the attic is serious. It sounds like it's not a lack of
insulation, rather a lack of ventilation. In any case, this is serious and
will become even more of a problem. You need more ventilation in the attic.
(Could be a code issue).

As to the floor, the were willing to replace it and you said no. Now you
still have a defective floor. (Not certain as to what you meant by "inferior
flooring".)

The rest of your complaints are either too vague or nonsense.

Post by Matt W. Barrow

Post by marson
On a number of occasions, I've had modular homes salesmen give me this
BS that their product costs less than site built because they are
built in a factory under controlled conditions.
Fact is, they often
cost less because they are slapped together garbage--

And I've seen a lot of pretty shabby stick-built construction done that
way and worse.

Post by marson
if a decent
contractor was asked to produce a home of the same design and quality
as many of the modular homes we see, his price would be competitive.
In construction, time is money. The only way to put out a quality
product is by spending more time on the details, and that is going to
cost more. That's the way it is.

So what's your point? That some people use shitty materials? Or poor QC?
Well DUH!

[marson]

Post by Matt W. Barrow

Post by marson
On a number of occasions, I've had modular homes salesmen give me this
BS that their product costs less than site built because they are
built in a factory under controlled conditions.
Fact is, they often
cost less because they are slapped together garbage--

And I've seen a lot of pretty shabby stick-built construction done that way
and worse.

Post by marson
if a decent
contractor was asked to produce a home of the same design and quality
as many of the modular homes we see, his price would be competitive.
In construction, time is money. The only way to put out a quality
product is by spending more time on the details, and that is going to
cost more. That's the way it is.

So what's your point? That some people use shitty materials? Or poor QC?
Well DUH!

You're missing my point. I have sat through sales presentations from
modular salesman whose basic premise is that through the miracles of
factory production methods, economies of scale, etc, they can supply
this fantastic home for a low, low price. I say that the low price is
often reached by slapping together garbage, cheap materials, cutting
corners, etc. Not really much different than a site built home. Time
is money, and quality takes time.

I agree with Dennis that there are some decent modulars out there.
And of course there are shoddy contractors.

[Matt W. Barrow]

Post by marson

Post by Matt W. Barrow

Post by marson
On a number of occasions, I've had modular homes salesmen give me this
BS that their product costs less than site built because they are
built in a factory under controlled conditions.
Fact is, they often
cost less because they are slapped together garbage--

And I've seen a lot of pretty shabby stick-built construction done that way
and worse.

Post by marson
if a decent
contractor was asked to produce a home of the same design and quality
as many of the modular homes we see, his price would be competitive.
In construction, time is money. The only way to put out a quality
product is by spending more time on the details, and that is going to
cost more. That's the way it is.

So what's your point? That some people use shitty materials? Or poor QC?
Well DUH!

You're missing my point. I have sat through sales presentations from
modular salesman whose basic premise is that through the miracles of
factory production methods, economies of scale, etc, they can supply
this fantastic home for a low, low price. I say that the low price is
often reached by slapping together garbage, cheap materials, cutting
corners, etc. Not really much different than a site built home. Time
is money, and quality takes time.

Well, you need to get out more.

Factory built frames and trusses are FAR better than site built.

Just like any manufactured items, some are better than others.

Using good material, factory built can be up in about 1/3 the time of
conventional, and you don;t have to worry about weather, pillferage, etc.

Time is money and labor is time consuming.

Post by marson
I agree with Dennis that there are some decent modulars out there.
And of course there are shoddy contractors.

So don't lump them all together and generalize based on very limited
experience.

[marson]

Post by Matt W. Barrow
Factory built frames and trusses are FAR better than site built.

Matt, that simply isn't true. I have looked at a number of panelized
houses (high end custom houses), and as for fit, finish, straightness
etc. of the framing, they just don't compare to a good custom frame
job done on site. They go up fast, they get dried in fast, but don't
try to tell me that they are better. They're just not.

Last winter I built a custom house right next door to a $800,000 panel
house, and by the end the owner of the panel house would come over and
look at the one we were working on and I could tell he realized he
made a mistake. All you had to do is stand at a corner and sight down
a wall and look at the whoops. He had a good contractor, but if the
panel is put together with crooked studs and plates in them, you're
screwed. Factory or no, the lumber comes from trees. That's not the
only story I've heard like that.

Of course you must realize that most roofs are put together with
factory built trusses. It's been that way for quite a while.

See you later.

[Matt W. Barrow]

Post by marson

Post by Matt W. Barrow
Factory built frames and trusses are FAR better than site built.

Matt, that simply isn't true. I have looked at a number of panelized
houses (high end custom houses), and as for fit, finish, straightness
etc. of the framing, they just don't compare to a good custom frame
job done on site. They go up fast, they get dried in fast, but don't
try to tell me that they are better. They're just not.

They can't be. It would violate the laws of physics.

Post by marson
Last winter I built a custom house right next door to a $800,000 panel
house, and by the end the owner of the panel house would come over and
look at the one we were working on and I could tell he realized he
made a mistake. All you had to do is stand at a corner and sight down
a wall and look at the whoops. He had a good contractor, but if the
panel is put together with crooked studs and plates in them, you're
screwed. Factory or no, the lumber comes from trees. That's not the
only story I've heard like that.

You may not realize it, but you just contradicted yourself.

Post by marson
Of course you must realize that most roofs are put together with
factory built trusses. It's been that way for quite a while.

Think about why the automotive and other precision industries do their
manufacturing on CAM and robotics.

[marson]

I'd like to end my posting on this thread by pointing out that modular
homes and panelized homes are another step in a long succession of
changes that started back when carpenters quit fitting studs with
mortise and tenon joints and started using nails. Less craftsmanship
required and a lower quality end product. Yes there are exceptions to
that last sentence (roof trusses come to mind). These changes have
been brought about by economic forces. I'm not saying we should go
back to the old days, but it is sad when you think of it. We have a
100+ year old mansion in our town open for tours. All full of hand
carved trim, which was all done by local craftsman. That level of
craftsmanship doesn't exist anymore for any price. The people who
could do that just aren't there.

Matt, get the last word if you want. I really think flame wars are
pretty silly. I'm a carpenter who has been observing the industry for
some years now. I'll stand by what I post.

[Barold]

I think this thread is an interesting commentary on general building
construction in a time when quality home builders must compete with
low-cost builders of varying stripes.

When building my home in 2004, I took great pains to gather "best
practice" information from books and this very newsgroup. I was amazed
to see, hear and read the varying "opinons" about how to do things.
While installing our Tyvek, windows and window flashing, I had a
friend (full-time school teacher who worked for a low-cost builder
framing houses in the summer) to help. He commented that we were
going above and beyond what his company was doing when installing
house wrap and windows, namely the window flashing and insulation. He
said that his company stapled up the housewrap and nailed in the
windows, and installed the vinyl siding. They didn't take the time to
lap the top piece of housewrap over the lip of the window frame. In a
few years, I'm sure most of the framing around the windows,
particularly the sills, would be rotten.

The point is this.. he said that on his construction crew, there were
a couple quality carpenters, a few guys like him (part-time summer
help, college students, etc.), and a bunch of yahoos who could swing a
hammer and needed a job between jail stints. You get what you pay
for.

[Matt W. Barrow]

Post by Barold
I think this thread is an interesting commentary on general building
construction in a time when quality home builders must compete with
low-cost builders of varying stripes.
When building my home in 2004, I took great pains to gather "best
practice" information from books and this very newsgroup. I was amazed
to see, hear and read the varying "opinons" about how to do things.
While installing our Tyvek, windows and window flashing, I had a
friend (full-time school teacher who worked for a low-cost builder
framing houses in the summer) to help. He commented that we were
going above and beyond what his company was doing when installing
house wrap and windows, namely the window flashing and insulation. He
said that his company stapled up the housewrap and nailed in the
windows, and installed the vinyl siding. They didn't take the time to
lap the top piece of housewrap over the lip of the window frame. In a
few years, I'm sure most of the framing around the windows,
particularly the sills, would be rotten.
The point is this.. he said that on his construction crew, there were
a couple quality carpenters, a few guys like him (part-time summer
help, college students, etc.), and a bunch of yahoos who could swing a
hammer and needed a job between jail stints. You get what you pay
for.

Understand, too, "boom and bust" cycles and how they affect building cost as
well as how much trouble the builder is going to go through.

As well, if a "good contractor" is using shitty material, or worse, does not
recognize shitty material, he's no long a "good contractor".

Finally, as an analogy, if 10 of the 60 some odd car manufacturers are using
low grade material and processes, it sonly speaks for those 10, not the
industry as a whole.

"marson" misses these points at every turn.

[f***@hotmail.com]

Just one more example of good old American disposable housing.
Doesn't matter if it's modular or site built, there are a lot of bad
builders and some bad materials that do not have any room for error
when installed. And since the installers are often unskilled and
uncaring, they makes lots of errors. Then the errors are covered up,
to rear their ugly heads just after the warranty runs out.

Not that it'll help THIS guy, but just FYI for anyone else, put
notification of defects in writing and send it Certified Return
Receipt Mail so you can prove they were notified within the warranty
period. A good paper trail has saved many people's cases, but it's an
uphill battle in any case.

One reason it's so hard is that there is surprisingly little
accountability for bad builders, something that often comes as a
surprise to the homeowner with a problem.

Also, the homeowner often can't sue due to mandatory binding
arbitration clauses common in construction and warranty contracts.
When their right to sue is gone, the builder knows disputes will be
forced into private arbitration where the company usually wins, and
the incident is hidden from public view in all but one state. "Wins"
in arbitration typically only pay a fraction of actual damages, too.
This is why the clause is in so many builder contracts and home
warranties.

Last but not least, a home buyer needs to either BE an expert or HIRE
an expert, to oversee construction. You can't count on codes being
enforced, nor can you count on builders being ethical and competent.
Sadly, the industry has a lot of bad apples. All the crap you have to
do, to ensure you don't get ripped off, adds to the cost of a house,
as does unexpected repairs on a new house. That's what makes the
building industry's hollow argument that being held accountable would
"raise the cost of housing" so, well, so hollow.

Beware:   Do not buy a modular home until you learn of our nightmare
experience.
We bought our new modular home from New Millenium, Warner, NH.  The home
was built by ProBuilt; Miffleton, PA.  The dealer refuses to fix any
problems stating we needed to contact within a year of taking possesion.
The problem is some problems (ie. mold,mildew moisture) took more than a
year to develop.  further, some problems (ie. siding) required that the
building systems be dismantled.  The dealer states now that more than a
year has transpiredThe following are the problems we have to file a claim
with the home warranty people.  The dealer must know, a reasonable person
would expect, that the home warranty, a major selling point of theirs so
they must be familar with its provisions, does not cover water, moisture,
1.  All exterior doors out of square.
2.All exterior doors leak lke seives when it rains.
3.  Moisture infiltration somewhere near my daughter's room causing a
mildew odor.
4.  Baseboard trim nail shot through drain pipe rendering sink unusable.
They said they were willing to fix this one but the process the required
was too ardous.  Also, they did such a shitty job taping the hole I did
not want to cut a hole in the drywall.  The vanity needed to be removed to
spare my wall any more patch jobs.
5.  Bubbling and sliced vinyl kitchen floor.  Once again they said they
were willing to repair this but also stated the whole floor would need to
be replaced.  They would not replace it in kind, instead they wanted to
substitute inferior flooring for it.
6.  Improperly installed siding.
7.  Incomplete attic insulation which allows condensation to form under
the attic deck.  I found this today as I was hiding Christmas presents.  I
noticed one board was saturated.  I began pulling up the decking and the
problem was widespread.  As I said, this was found today, approx. 2 yrs
and 3 months after taking possesion.  I haven't decided what to do yet.
8.  Peeling cabinet veneer.  They did provide new veneer but left it to us
to install.
9.  One driver delivering the house arrived four hours late, got stuck for
more than 30 minutes down at the corner, ran over the stop sign, went of
the road coming up our straight road, got stuck turning into our driveway,
crushed our culvert, got stuck again in the driveway.  Our dealer's
comment was, "Boy, I don't know what is up with George.  He's usually one
of our best drivers".  Later she did concede that she heard the crew
laughing about how bad he was.  She also offered to replace the culvert.
10.  No consistant pattern or logic to the electrical wiring (ie.
different corresponding switches in different rooms activate different
lights)
This why I believe modular homes, New Millenium and ProBuilt Homes suck.
I elect to remain anonymous because once we can sell this place in good
conscience we are selling.  This place will never be right.
Anonymous.
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[Matt W. Barrow]

Post by f***@hotmail.com
Also, the homeowner often can't sue due to mandatory binding
arbitration clauses common in construction and warranty contracts.

Really? Where is that?

Post by f***@hotmail.com
When their right to sue is gone, the builder knows disputes will be
forced into private arbitration where the company usually wins, and
the incident is hidden from public view in all but one state. "Wins"
in arbitration typically only pay a fraction of actual damages, too.
This is why the clause is in so many builder contracts and home
warranties.

On what planet?

Post by f***@hotmail.com
You can't count on codes being enforced, nor can you count on
builders being ethical and competent.

On what planet?

[seahawkbuyer]

Go to : http://seahawkbuyer.googlepages.com/home > for another
purchasers story.

Post by modularhomessuck
Beware: Do not buy a modular home until you learn of our nightmare
experience.
We bought our new modular home from New Millenium, Warner, NH. The home
was built by ProBuilt; Miffleton, PA. The dealer refuses to fix any
problems stating we needed to contact within a year of taking possesion.
The problem is some problems (ie. mold,mildew moisture) took more than a
year to develop. further, some problems (ie. siding) required that the
building systems be dismantled. The dealer states now that more than a
year has transpiredThe following are the problems we have to file a claim
with the home warranty people. The dealer must know, a reasonable person
would expect, that the home warranty, a major selling point of theirs so
they must be familar with its provisions, does not cover water, moisture,
1. All exterior doors out of square.
2.All exterior doors leak lke seives when it rains.
3. Moisture infiltration somewhere near my daughter's room causing a
mildew odor.
4. Baseboard trim nail shot through drain pipe rendering sink unusable.
They said they were willing to fix this one but the process the required
was too ardous. Also, they did such a shitty job taping the hole I did
not want to cut a hole in the drywall. The vanity needed to be removed to
spare my wall any more patch jobs.
5. Bubbling and sliced vinyl kitchen floor. Once again they said they
were willing to repair this but also stated the whole floor would need to
be replaced. They would not replace it in kind, instead they wanted to
substitute inferior flooring for it.
6. Improperly installed siding.
7. Incomplete attic insulation which allows condensation to form under
the attic deck. I found this today as I was hiding Christmas presents. I
noticed one board was saturated. I began pulling up the decking and the
problem was widespread. As I said, this was found today, approx. 2 yrs
and 3 months after taking possesion. I haven't decided what to do yet.
8. Peeling cabinet veneer. They did provide new veneer but left it to us
to install.
9. One driver delivering the house arrived four hours late, got stuck for
more than 30 minutes down at the corner, ran over the stop sign, went of
the road coming up our straight road, got stuck turning into our driveway,
crushed our culvert, got stuck again in the driveway. Our dealer's
comment was, "Boy, I don't know what is up with George. He's usually one
of our best drivers". Later she did concede that she heard the crew
laughing about how bad he was. She also offered to replace the culvert.
10. No consistant pattern or logic to the electrical wiring (ie.
different corresponding switches in different rooms activate different
lights)
This why I believe modular homes, New Millenium and ProBuilt Homes suck.
I elect to remain anonymous because once we can sell this place in good
conscience we are selling. This place will never be right.
Anonymous.
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[marson]

Go to :http://seahawkbuyer.googlepages.com/home > for another
purchasers story.

Post by modularhomessuck
Beware: Do not buy a modular home until you learn of our nightmare
experience.
We bought our new modular home from New Millenium, Warner, NH. The home
was built by ProBuilt; Miffleton, PA. The dealer refuses to fix any
problems stating we needed to contact within a year of taking possesion.
The problem is some problems (ie. mold,mildew moisture) took more than a
year to develop. further, some problems (ie. siding) required that the
building systems be dismantled. The dealer states now that more than a
year has transpiredThe following are the problems we have to file a claim
with the home warranty people. The dealer must know, a reasonable person
would expect, that the home warranty, a major selling point of theirs so
they must be familar with its provisions, does not cover water, moisture,
1. All exterior doors out of square.
2.All exterior doors leak lke seives when it rains.
3. Moisture infiltration somewhere near my daughter's room causing a
mildew odor.
4. Baseboard trim nail shot through drain pipe rendering sink unusable.
They said they were willing to fix this one but the process the required
was too ardous. Also, they did such a shitty job taping the hole I did
not want to cut a hole in the drywall. The vanity needed to be removed to
spare my wall any more patch jobs.
5. Bubbling and sliced vinyl kitchen floor. Once again they said they
were willing to repair this but also stated the whole floor would need to
be replaced. They would not replace it in kind, instead they wanted to
substitute inferior flooring for it.
6. Improperly installed siding.
7. Incomplete attic insulation which allows condensation to form under
the attic deck. I found this today as I was hiding Christmas presents. I
noticed one board was saturated. I began pulling up the decking and the
problem was widespread. As I said, this was found today, approx. 2 yrs
and 3 months after taking possesion. I haven't decided what to do yet.
8. Peeling cabinet veneer. They did provide new veneer but left it to us
to install.
9. One driver delivering the house arrived four hours late, got stuck for
more than 30 minutes down at the corner, ran over the stop sign, went of
the road coming up our straight road, got stuck turning into our driveway,
crushed our culvert, got stuck again in the driveway. Our dealer's
comment was, "Boy, I don't know what is up with George. He's usually one
of our best drivers". Later she did concede that she heard the crew
laughing about how bad he was. She also offered to replace the culvert.
10. No consistant pattern or logic to the electrical wiring (ie.
different corresponding switches in different rooms activate different
lights)
This why I believe modular homes, New Millenium and ProBuilt Homes suck.
I elect to remain anonymous because once we can sell this place in good
conscience we are selling. This place will never be right.
Anonymous.
-------------------------------------
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Nice Pics. That factory-built quality is great! Just like a Mercedes
Benz, hey Matt!!

[Andy Energy]

Post by modularhomessuck
Beware: Do not buy a modular home until you learn of our nightmare
experience.
We bought our new modular home from New Millenium, Warner, NH. The home
was built by ProBuilt; Miffleton, PA. The dealer refuses to fix any
problems stating we needed to contact within a year of taking possesion.
The problem is some problems (ie. mold,mildew moisture) took more than a
year to develop. further, some problems (ie. siding) required that the
building systems be dismantled. The dealer states now that more than a
year has transpiredThe following are the problems we have to file a claim
with the home warranty people. The dealer must know, a reasonable person
would expect, that the home warranty, a major selling point of theirs so
they must be familar with its provisions, does not cover water, moisture,
1. All exterior doors out of square.
2.All exterior doors leak lke seives when it rains.
3. Moisture infiltration somewhere near my daughter's room causing a
mildew odor.
4. Baseboard trim nail shot through drain pipe rendering sink unusable.
They said they were willing to fix this one but the process the required
was too ardous. Also, they did such a shitty job taping the hole I did
not want to cut a hole in the drywall. The vanity needed to be removed to
spare my wall any more patch jobs.
5. Bubbling and sliced vinyl kitchen floor. Once again they said they
were willing to repair this but also stated the whole floor would need to
be replaced. They would not replace it in kind, instead they wanted to
substitute inferior flooring for it.
6. Improperly installed siding.
7. Incomplete attic insulation which allows condensation to form under
the attic deck. I found this today as I was hiding Christmas presents. I
noticed one board was saturated. I began pulling up the decking and the
problem was widespread. As I said, this was found today, approx. 2 yrs
and 3 months after taking possesion. I haven't decided what to do yet.
8. Peeling cabinet veneer. They did provide new veneer but left it to us
to install.
9. One driver delivering the house arrived four hours late, got stuck for
more than 30 minutes down at the corner, ran over the stop sign, went of
the road coming up our straight road, got stuck turning into our driveway,
crushed our culvert, got stuck again in the driveway. Our dealer's
comment was, "Boy, I don't know what is up with George. He's usually one
of our best drivers". Later she did concede that she heard the crew
laughing about how bad he was. She also offered to replace the culvert.
10. No consistant pattern or logic to the electrical wiring (ie.
different corresponding switches in different rooms activate different
lights)
This why I believe modular homes, New Millenium and ProBuilt Homes suck.
I elect to remain anonymous because once we can sell this place in good
conscience we are selling. This place will never be right.
Anonymous.
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Several points:

1) We should have a house lemon law.
2) This house sounds like the one my brother bought.
3) I'd like to address Item #7.

Lacking insulation will not cause moisture to form on the underside of
the deck. Older homes that have no ceiling insulation remain bone
dry. The issue is air leakage up through the house carrying warm
moist air or a roof leak. The basement being dry may be because the
volume of air flowing up through the house is bringing in enough cool
air from out side. As the cold air is raised in temperature the % or
relative humidity is decreased. And this keeps the basement dry in the
winter. It then takes on the moisture from the basement and what the
occupants add. When it exits the structure in the winter the
temperature decreases, thus increasing the RH%. If the RH reaches
100% we than have the due point and droplets of water form. This can
make an attic wet and cause serious rotting.

Most homes have a variety of holes (1,000's). The plumbing and
electrical penetrations in both floor and ceiling of the structure.
In a modular home where the two or more sections come together can
have a large opening from the bottom to the top. Many think stuffing
insulation in the gaps works. Loose fill or batt insulation does not
stop air flow. One needs to use a solid material such as, caulk,
spray foam, and for large holes use a sheet material (metal, plywood,
OSB etc.) and then foam or caulk the edges.

Then there is duct leakage, does your house has ducts? When ducts
leak they can be a large driving force, forcing infiltration and
exfiltration. If the dominate duct leakage is in the return and they
are technically outside the house (may actually reside inside the
structure but be technically outside) the house will go positive and
push warm moist air out. If the dominate duct leakage is in the
supply ducts and they are technically outside the house (may actually
reside inside the structure but be technically outside) the house will
go negative.

Then there are pressures across doors. Most forced air heating systems
have a single return. When a door to a room is closed and the heating
system runs it pressurizes the room forcing air out. It takes the
path of least resistance. Some of this air leaves the structure, into
the attic, walls etc. This then causes a negative pressure in the
area with the return is. In turn it gets its air from the path of
least resistance. So some rooms are forcing air out of the house
while others are pulling air in.

Are there bath and kitchen vent fans and do they actually vent to the
outside? Are the seams on the vents sealed? And a bathroom with a
window does not count, it needs a real fan. Fans must provide 8 air
changes per hour and be on a timer to run at least 20 minutes after
the occupant leaves the space.

All of this should be left to the professional. One needs a Blower
Door, a Duct Tester, an Infrared camera is also helpful and the
knowledge to use them. When one seals leaks in a structure it changes
the dynamics and needs to be retested.

When the house is out of balance many things can happen. Natural
draft appliances can back draft causing CO poisoning, water heater
can, if the pressures are high enough can have flame roll out. Warm
moist air can be forced in to cold cavities where the lower
temperature can cause condensation and rotting.


Andy W

[verizon_main]

Post by Andy Energy
Most homes have a variety of holes (1,000's). The plumbing and
electrical penetrations in both floor and ceiling of the structure.
In a modular home where the two or more sections come together can
have a large opening from the bottom to the top. Many think stuffing
insulation in the gaps works. Loose fill or batt insulation does not
stop air flow. One needs to use a solid material such as, caulk,
spray foam, and for large holes use a sheet material (metal, plywood,
OSB etc.) and then foam or caulk the edges.

Actually IRC section 1102.4 requires ALL utility penetrations to be sealed.
This includes DWV & NM Cable holes opening into the attic cavity. These are
usually sealed with a can of foam caulk. The joints between major sections,
such as that formed by the center mating all would need to be completely
sealed at the top and bottom with a foam tape (or similar).

The water condensing on the underside of the deck sounds like a lack of
ventilation, but there should not have been any cavity with out insulation.

His best recourse is to see if New Hampshire has any laws on the books to
protect him. Some states have enacted legislation which protects new home
owners for a period of ten years.

New Hampshire DOES have a MODULAR state building program. It's administered
by the Department of Safety under the State Fire Marshal's office (603)
371-3294 was the last number I had for their section. All manufacturer's are
required by state law to build within the state's building code

It could prove beneficial for the dissatisfied homeowner to call the State
and see what can be done (I'm certain the state will get some action).

[firewoodguy]

We bought a New England Home,Greenland,NH through their assigned dealer(Atlantic Blue Water Modular Homes; "ABW") back in early 2007. The modular (ranch style 15' x 52') was delivered and placed on the foundation on May 23ed, 2007 and its still not completed. It fail twice by Derry Building Enforcement by a walk thru inspection. The remaining onsite assembly of the modular was just thrown together and wasn't even assembled as outline by NEH site referance manual. NEH only repairs defects that occurs while at their factory. Once the modular leaves the factory which is about 85% completed, you are on your own. So when NEH advertises that their modular homes are quality built from start to finish,as a "turn key" home is hog pog. Think twice before you even think about buying a NEH. I know of 6 or 7 New Hampshire home owners that bought a NEH, which they are experiencing the same and even more defect workmanship and structural issues than we are. If you want to take a tour of this NEH and see for yourself, just call and setup a free tour.

Firewoodguy.co
-
Firewoodguy

[f***@yahoo.com]

Sorry to hear about your bad experience, If it's any consolation, I
know people who had similar experiences with brand new site built
homes and manufactured homes falling apart on them in their first
year.

Charlie Camp
Atlantic Mortgage
Satellite Beach, Fl
http://www.atlanticeloan.com/default.aspx

[Art K]

Why can’t we follow European standards in the use of quality materials, and for goodness sake, a decent esthetic. My mom lived in one of these slapped together cracker- boxes. California has created modular canyons. Cookie cutter designs. Every tremor caused cracking, floors warped, and creaked. Off gassing from wafer boards, and cheap carpeting. The manufacturers use subpar materials for maximum profit. Building codes allow them to cut corners. These dwellings do not age well. Do your research, and buyer beware. We always want the cheapest way out, and pay it all back for the first major repair